to wifi or not to wifi


Monte Single
 

Hi List,

 

I’ve seen   a couple messages on the list in the last 10 minutes,  and they seem to suggest that a wifi connection is more stable than an ethernet connection.

I would have thought the wired connection would be  better all round including things like zoom.

Would someone please clarify?

 

Cheers,

 

Monte


Kevin Minor
 

Hi Monte.

 

The laptop I have doesn’t have an Ethernet connection, so I got one that uses USB for its connection. With it plugged in, I had more intermittent connection to the internet, and my speed seemed slower. Things seem more stable with WI-FI. I had it directly connected to the PC, no hub was involved. The only reason I’d have a hard wired connection is if a job requires it.

 

This is my experience. Others may differ.

 

Kevin, Valerie and Jilly

 

From: win10@win10.groups.io <win10@win10.groups.io> On Behalf Of Monte Single
Sent: Saturday, January 9, 2021 7:50 PM
To: win10@win10.groups.io
Subject: [win10] to wifi or not to wifi

 

Hi List,

 

I’ve seen   a couple messages on the list in the last 10 minutes,  and they seem to suggest that a wifi connection is more stable than an ethernet connection.

I would have thought the wired connection would be  better all round including things like zoom.

Would someone please clarify?

 

Cheers,

 

Monte


Don H
 

In my experience ethernet is faster and more consistent.

On 1/9/2021 6:49 PM, Monte Single wrote:
Hi List,
I’ve seen   a couple messages on the list in the last 10 minutes,  and they seem to suggest that a wifi connection is more stable than an ethernet connection.
I would have thought the wired connection would be  better all round including things like zoom.
Would someone please clarify?
Cheers,
Monte


David Csercsics <bleeblat@...>
 

I don't understand this either. It's been my experience that ethernet lags less when it's wired. But they did say "for my situation". So what situation is wifi faster than wired. Maybe if you have fibre and you don't have a gigabit network card in your motherboard, but that hasn't been the case with most computers for years.


Brian Vogel <britechguy@...>
 

On Sat, Jan 9, 2021 at 08:01 PM, Don H wrote:
In my experience ethernet is faster and more consistent.
-
In virtually any experience, with things functioning normally, a direct wired connection (ethernet) will be both faster and more stable than WiFi is.

I use WiFi exclusively, and it's way more than fast enough and stable enough for my needs, and not being tethered is a huge plus well worth the speed performance hit, as far as I'm concerned.  Others will, very legitimately, differ, especially if they're using a computer that has no need to move about.
--

Brian - Windows 10 Pro, 64-Bit, Version 20H2, Build 19042

Journalism 101:  If someone says it’s raining and another person says it’s dry, it’s not your job to quote them both. It’s your job to look out the f**king window and find out which is true.

      ~ Jonathan Foster (attributed)


Monte Single
 

Thanks for all the answers.

For me a wired connection is best; I can see how a wifi  is best for others.

 

From: win10@win10.groups.io <win10@win10.groups.io> On Behalf Of Kevin Minor
Sent: January 9, 2021 7:00 PM
To: win10@win10.groups.io
Subject: Re: [win10] to wifi or not to Wi-Fi

 

Hi Monte.

 

The laptop I have doesn’t have an Ethernet connection, so I got one that uses USB for its connection. With it plugged in, I had more intermittent connection to the internet, and my speed seemed slower. Things seem more stable with WI-FI. I had it directly connected to the PC, no hub was involved. The only reason I’d have a hard wired connection is if a job requires it.

 

This is my experience. Others may differ.

 

Kevin, Valerie and Jilly

 

From: win10@win10.groups.io <win10@win10.groups.io> On Behalf Of Monte Single
Sent: Saturday, January 9, 2021 7:50 PM
To: win10@win10.groups.io
Subject: [win10] to wifi or not to wifi

 

Hi List,

 

I’ve seen   a couple messages on the list in the last 10 minutes,  and they seem to suggest that a wifi connection is more stable than an ethernet connection.

I would have thought the wired connection would be  better all round including things like zoom.

Would someone please clarify?

 

Cheers,

 

Monte


 

so to explain in short.
wifi can be used to browse the web, read things and books.
watch youtube videos.
but if you are doing something like gaming, zoom conference or any
conference wire is the best you get.

On 1/10/21, Brian Vogel <britechguy@gmail.com> wrote:
On Sat, Jan 9, 2021 at 08:01 PM, Don H wrote:


In my experience ethernet is faster and more consistent.
-
In virtually any experience, with things functioning normally, a direct
wired connection (ethernet) will be both faster and more stable than WiFi
is.

I use WiFi exclusively, and it's way more than fast enough and stable enough
for my needs, and not being tethered is a huge plus well worth the speed
performance hit, as far as I'm concerned.  Others will, very legitimately,
differ, especially if they're using a computer that has no need to move
about.
--

Brian *-* Windows 10 Pro, 64-Bit, Version 20H2, Build 19042

Journalism 101: *If someone says it’s raining and another person says it’s
dry, it’s not your job to quote them both. It’s your job to look out the
f**king window and find out which is true.*

~ Jonathan Foster (attributed)





--
search for me on facebook, google+, orkut..
austinpinto.xaviers@gmail.com
follow me on twitter.
austinmpinto
contact me on skype.
austin.pinto3


Sean Murphy
 

All,

 

I need to outline some basic networking concepts to explain why physical connection via a copper CAT 5 or higher is faster than wireless. I will provide a caveat in relation when using USB. These are very high level concepts.

 

Ethernet is a shared protocol thus (ISO layer 2 data link) kicks in here. Layer 2 is the grouping of data between two physical devices. Such as an Wireless Access point and a wired switch / hub. I will touch on these a bit later.

 

Wireless is technically a shared layer 1 (ISO standards physical layer), in other words is the technology used to send the data to the receiving device. The Access point (Wireless router) in a domestic world can have to radios at 2.4 GHZ or 5GHZ. Some routers combine these two different frequencies as a special frequency hop capability  which basically means if the 5ghz SSID cannot be connected, the Access point (AP) will automatically switch you to the 2.4 ghz radio. The speeds of 802.11 ranges from 54 mbs through to 1300 ghz, there is a higher throughput capability for 802.11 which I have never seen in domestic wireless routers. Thus I will not talk about it. The norm when using 802.11 AC or AD is around 300 to 400 mbs. The challenges with wireless:

  • Any physical obstructions impacts the quality of the signal which impacts your speed.
  • The quality of your AP impacts the speed of your traffic.
  • Number of devices on the network. If you have a large number of devices, the through put will reduce.
  • The quality of the radio / chip set in your laptop. A dual radio within a laptop is better than one.
  • Distance impacts your speed. The greater distance you are away from the AP quality of your signal goes down and thus your performance. All the faster speed standards are greatly impacted in this area. Where 802.11 A had a huge distance over 100 metres from memory.
  • Latency heavily impacts wireless technology. Just perform a ping using your wireless device to your local AP and then do the same ping test using wire. Wire is 0, wireless is always higher. This does have an impact
  • Signal noise also impacts your wireless performance. This could be moisture in the air. 2.4 GHZ used to be heavily impacted with SN but not so much at 5GHZ as the devices which impacted wireless do not use that frequency.
  • Packet collision – when your packet is received at the same time by another packet from a different device. The packets are not handled by the AP and the packets are requested to be sent again. This is the problem with shared network technology. Wired Ethernet hubs  have the same issue and are no longer available.

There will be other issues here such as encryption, amount of traffic, etc that can also impact your wireless.

 

Physical connections:

If you are using a hub as stated before, your throughput will be impacted. Today all domestic routers / Wi-Fi devices are true switches thus you do not get this issue. Hence your throughput from your pc to the router via a copper cable is going to be at 1gbs if that is the specifications. In fact, when you copy a file from one pc to another on the same network using physical cables. Then the throughput is at what ever speed the two devices can handle which with todays new pcs should be close to 1gbs.

 

Note: A hub is a layer 1 device for ethernet wired devices. Similar to an Wi-Fi access point but really brain dead. A switch is technically a layer 2 device which supports single connection between the switch and the end device. The switch handles all the communication in a clever way to prevent packet collision as outline before. This is why you get better throughput on wired networks with switch and also routers. I will not explain routers here.

to

Standard cat 5 supports up to 100 metres / 60 ft without signal loss from memory. Over this distance, you will get signal loss. Thus in theory if your network port is 100 mbs or 1gbs, then this is the speed you should get. Now there is cat 6E which I don’t recall the specs but primarily for 1gbs throughput. Using copper unshielded twisted pair cables you don’t get single loss if you are within the specifications. Latency between any device that is connected on a wired network in your house will be 0. Only time it might creep up if you have huge amount of data going over your network. EG: copying your whole hard drive from one pc to another and then you want to watch a video from the other hard drive.

All the other issues I have outlined for wi-fi does not apply to wired networks.

 

Note: to understand your real throughput  in bytes is not a simple formula of dividing by 8. EG: 100 mbps / 8 is 12.5 MBps (Megabytes per second). As there are networking protocols to take into account here and the quality of your network equipment. This also applies to wireless. The best I have ever seen with 100 mBps is around 8 to 10 megabytes per second.

The only issues with wired networks:

  • Quality of cables.
  • Quality of the Network Interface Card (NIC). USB adapters fall in this space. If the USB Ethernet dongle is not high quality, then your performance will b impacted as outlined already on this thread. USB B should be able to handle 1gbs throughput, but I have not done any research in this space. As all the devices I buy have physical  NICS.
  • You are locked at your desk.

 

In conclusion:

If you are using the internet then it doesn’t really matter if you use wired or wireless. As your connection to the internet is going to be the biggest issue here and the sites you visit. The issue of performance is far to complex to explain here. Lets just say, there are so many variables and issues here that trying to truly understand your real performance is not a worthwhile activity for the average person. If you are getting performance issues using a conference tool like Teams, WebEx or Zoom (the only three I will use). Is the issue at your end, the service you using or something in-between. As someone who was a network engineer for Cisco in their Technical Assistance Centre. Trying to explain throughput and performance to customers was a real challenge. AS the average person doesn’t understand this concept at the technical level. Lets just say, there is a lot of hidden overheads when talking about networking equipment.

 

Sean

 

 

 

From: win10@win10.groups.io <win10@win10.groups.io> On Behalf Of Monte Single
Sent: Sunday, January 10, 2021 1:01 PM
To: win10@win10.groups.io
Subject: Re: [win10] to wifi or not to wifi

 

Thanks for all the answers.

For me a wired connection is best; I can see how a wifi  is best for others.

 

From: win10@win10.groups.io <win10@win10.groups.io> On Behalf Of Kevin Minor
Sent: January 9, 2021 7:00 PM
To: win10@win10.groups.io
Subject: Re: [win10] to wifi or not to Wi-Fi

 

Hi Monte.

 

The laptop I have doesn’t have an Ethernet connection, so I got one that uses USB for its connection. With it plugged in, I had more intermittent connection to the internet, and my speed seemed slower. Things seem more stable with WI-FI. I had it directly connected to the PC, no hub was involved. The only reason I’d have a hard wired connection is if a job requires it.

 

This is my experience. Others may differ.

 

Kevin, Valerie and Jilly

 

From: win10@win10.groups.io <win10@win10.groups.io> On Behalf Of Monte Single
Sent: Saturday, January 9, 2021 7:50 PM
To: win10@win10.groups.io
Subject: [win10] to wifi or not to wifi

 

Hi List,

 

I’ve seen   a couple messages on the list in the last 10 minutes,  and they seem to suggest that a wifi connection is more stable than an ethernet connection.

I would have thought the wired connection would be  better all round including things like zoom.

Would someone please clarify?

 

Cheers,

 

Monte


enes sarıbaş
 

Hi Brian,

I am one of those. My laptop sits in a specific location, and never moves. Also, I can see over 45 or so wireless networks in my apartment, so the performance hit will be alot higher due to interferance.

On 1/9/2021 7:29 PM, Brian Vogel wrote:
On Sat, Jan 9, 2021 at 08:01 PM, Don H wrote:
In my experience ethernet is faster and more consistent.
-
In virtually any experience, with things functioning normally, a direct wired connection (ethernet) will be both faster and more stable than WiFi is.

I use WiFi exclusively, and it's way more than fast enough and stable enough for my needs, and not being tethered is a huge plus well worth the speed performance hit, as far as I'm concerned.  Others will, very legitimately, differ, especially if they're using a computer that has no need to move about.
--

Brian - Windows 10 Pro, 64-Bit, Version 20H2, Build 19042

Journalism 101:  If someone says it’s raining and another person says it’s dry, it’s not your job to quote them both. It’s your job to look out the f**king window and find out which is true.

      ~ Jonathan Foster (attributed)


enes sarıbaş
 

Also, USB C is able to handle 2.5 gbps ethernet.

On 1/9/2021 11:24 PM, Sean Murphy wrote:

All,

 

I need to outline some basic networking concepts to explain why physical connection via a copper CAT 5 or higher is faster than wireless. I will provide a caveat in relation when using USB. These are very high level concepts.

 

Ethernet is a shared protocol thus (ISO layer 2 data link) kicks in here. Layer 2 is the grouping of data between two physical devices. Such as an Wireless Access point and a wired switch / hub. I will touch on these a bit later.

 

Wireless is technically a shared layer 1 (ISO standards physical layer), in other words is the technology used to send the data to the receiving device. The Access point (Wireless router) in a domestic world can have to radios at 2.4 GHZ or 5GHZ. Some routers combine these two different frequencies as a special frequency hop capability  which basically means if the 5ghz SSID cannot be connected, the Access point (AP) will automatically switch you to the 2.4 ghz radio. The speeds of 802.11 ranges from 54 mbs through to 1300 ghz, there is a higher throughput capability for 802.11 which I have never seen in domestic wireless routers. Thus I will not talk about it. The norm when using 802.11 AC or AD is around 300 to 400 mbs. The challenges with wireless:

  • Any physical obstructions impacts the quality of the signal which impacts your speed.
  • The quality of your AP impacts the speed of your traffic.
  • Number of devices on the network. If you have a large number of devices, the through put will reduce.
  • The quality of the radio / chip set in your laptop. A dual radio within a laptop is better than one.
  • Distance impacts your speed. The greater distance you are away from the AP quality of your signal goes down and thus your performance. All the faster speed standards are greatly impacted in this area. Where 802.11 A had a huge distance over 100 metres from memory.
  • Latency heavily impacts wireless technology. Just perform a ping using your wireless device to your local AP and then do the same ping test using wire. Wire is 0, wireless is always higher. This does have an impact
  • Signal noise also impacts your wireless performance. This could be moisture in the air. 2.4 GHZ used to be heavily impacted with SN but not so much at 5GHZ as the devices which impacted wireless do not use that frequency.
  • Packet collision – when your packet is received at the same time by another packet from a different device. The packets are not handled by the AP and the packets are requested to be sent again. This is the problem with shared network technology. Wired Ethernet hubs  have the same issue and are no longer available.

There will be other issues here such as encryption, amount of traffic, etc that can also impact your wireless.

 

Physical connections:

If you are using a hub as stated before, your throughput will be impacted. Today all domestic routers / Wi-Fi devices are true switches thus you do not get this issue. Hence your throughput from your pc to the router via a copper cable is going to be at 1gbs if that is the specifications. In fact, when you copy a file from one pc to another on the same network using physical cables. Then the throughput is at what ever speed the two devices can handle which with todays new pcs should be close to 1gbs.

 

Note: A hub is a layer 1 device for ethernet wired devices. Similar to an Wi-Fi access point but really brain dead. A switch is technically a layer 2 device which supports single connection between the switch and the end device. The switch handles all the communication in a clever way to prevent packet collision as outline before. This is why you get better throughput on wired networks with switch and also routers. I will not explain routers here.

to

Standard cat 5 supports up to 100 metres / 60 ft without signal loss from memory. Over this distance, you will get signal loss. Thus in theory if your network port is 100 mbs or 1gbs, then this is the speed you should get. Now there is cat 6E which I don’t recall the specs but primarily for 1gbs throughput. Using copper unshielded twisted pair cables you don’t get single loss if you are within the specifications. Latency between any device that is connected on a wired network in your house will be 0. Only time it might creep up if you have huge amount of data going over your network. EG: copying your whole hard drive from one pc to another and then you want to watch a video from the other hard drive.

All the other issues I have outlined for wi-fi does not apply to wired networks.

 

Note: to understand your real throughput  in bytes is not a simple formula of dividing by 8. EG: 100 mbps / 8 is 12.5 MBps (Megabytes per second). As there are networking protocols to take into account here and the quality of your network equipment. This also applies to wireless. The best I have ever seen with 100 mBps is around 8 to 10 megabytes per second.

The only issues with wired networks:

  • Quality of cables.
  • Quality of the Network Interface Card (NIC). USB adapters fall in this space. If the USB Ethernet dongle is not high quality, then your performance will b impacted as outlined already on this thread. USB B should be able to handle 1gbs throughput, but I have not done any research in this space. As all the devices I buy have physical  NICS.
  • You are locked at your desk.

 

In conclusion:

If you are using the internet then it doesn’t really matter if you use wired or wireless. As your connection to the internet is going to be the biggest issue here and the sites you visit. The issue of performance is far to complex to explain here. Lets just say, there are so many variables and issues here that trying to truly understand your real performance is not a worthwhile activity for the average person. If you are getting performance issues using a conference tool like Teams, WebEx or Zoom (the only three I will use). Is the issue at your end, the service you using or something in-between. As someone who was a network engineer for Cisco in their Technical Assistance Centre. Trying to explain throughput and performance to customers was a real challenge. AS the average person doesn’t understand this concept at the technical level. Lets just say, there is a lot of hidden overheads when talking about networking equipment.

 

Sean

 

 

 

From: win10@win10.groups.io <win10@win10.groups.io> On Behalf Of Monte Single
Sent: Sunday, January 10, 2021 1:01 PM
To: win10@win10.groups.io
Subject: Re: [win10] to wifi or not to wifi

 

Thanks for all the answers.

For me a wired connection is best; I can see how a wifi  is best for others.

 

From: win10@win10.groups.io <win10@win10.groups.io> On Behalf Of Kevin Minor
Sent: January 9, 2021 7:00 PM
To: win10@win10.groups.io
Subject: Re: [win10] to wifi or not to Wi-Fi

 

Hi Monte.

 

The laptop I have doesn’t have an Ethernet connection, so I got one that uses USB for its connection. With it plugged in, I had more intermittent connection to the internet, and my speed seemed slower. Things seem more stable with WI-FI. I had it directly connected to the PC, no hub was involved. The only reason I’d have a hard wired connection is if a job requires it.

 

This is my experience. Others may differ.

 

Kevin, Valerie and Jilly

 

From: win10@win10.groups.io <win10@win10.groups.io> On Behalf Of Monte Single
Sent: Saturday, January 9, 2021 7:50 PM
To: win10@win10.groups.io
Subject: [win10] to wifi or not to wifi

 

Hi List,

 

I’ve seen   a couple messages on the list in the last 10 minutes,  and they seem to suggest that a wifi connection is more stable than an ethernet connection.

I would have thought the wired connection would be  better all round including things like zoom.

Would someone please clarify?

 

Cheers,

 

Monte


Mike Capelle <mcap1000@...>
 

I use wyfy on  my machine, I would not go back to wired.

 

From: win10@win10.groups.io <win10@win10.groups.io> On Behalf Of Monte Single
Sent: Saturday, January 9, 2021 6:50 PM
To: win10@win10.groups.io
Subject: [win10] to wifi or not to wifi

 

Hi List,

 

I’ve seen   a couple messages on the list in the last 10 minutes,  and they seem to suggest that a wifi connection is more stable than an ethernet connection.

I would have thought the wired connection would be  better all round including things like zoom.

Would someone please clarify?

 

Cheers,

 

Monte


Jason White
 

On 1/10/21 4:00 AM, enes sarıbaş wrote:

I am one of those. My laptop sits in a specific location, and never moves. Also, I can see over 45 or so wireless networks in my apartment, so the performance hit will be alot higher due to interferance.

Mine is similar. The laptop only moves when it is to be taken with me out of the building. I had Ethernet cable professionally installed in the apartment during rennovations.

If you are using WiFi, as I certainly am for other devices, choosing a relatively clear channel in the 5GHz range is a good idea. I don't know of any Windows applications for scanning the WiFi channels, but I would expect they're available. My router can do it.


Hamit Campos
 

Yeah I use WIFI. I do prefer wire though. But then again I not only listen to the vids some if they are cool enough I'll download with Pontis.

-----Original Message-----
From: win10@win10.groups.io <win10@win10.groups.io> On Behalf Of Jason White via groups.io
Sent: Sunday, January 10, 2021 10:29 AM
To: win10@win10.groups.io
Subject: Re: [win10] to wifi or not to wifi


On 1/10/21 4:00 AM, enes sarıbaş wrote:

I am one of those. My laptop sits in a specific location, and never
moves. Also, I can see over 45 or so wireless networks in my
apartment, so the performance hit will be alot higher due to interferance.

Mine is similar. The laptop only moves when it is to be taken with me out of the building. I had Ethernet cable professionally installed in the apartment during rennovations.

If you are using WiFi, as I certainly am for other devices, choosing a relatively clear channel in the 5GHz range is a good idea. I don't know of any Windows applications for scanning the WiFi channels, but I would expect they're available. My router can do it.


Sarah k Alawami
 

I'm on a gig down and up connection so for me I get about 700 mb on wifi on a good day. I do zoom over wifi and it holds, but if you want stable, not necessarily fast, go hard wired as I call it. It will take priority over wifi, always.

--

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On 9 Jan 2021, at 20:59, Austin Pinto wrote:

so to explain in short.
wifi can be used to browse the web, read things and books.
watch youtube videos.
but if you are doing something like gaming, zoom conference or any
conference wire is the best you get.

On 1/10/21, Brian Vogel <britechguy@...> wrote:

On Sat, Jan 9, 2021 at 08:01 PM, Don H wrote:

In my experience ethernet is faster and more consistent.

-
In virtually any experience, with things functioning normally, a direct
wired connection (ethernet) will be both faster and more stable than WiFi
is.

I use WiFi exclusively, and it's way more than fast enough and stable enough
for my needs, and not being tethered is a huge plus well worth the speed
performance hit, as far as I'm concerned.  Others will, very legitimately,
differ, especially if they're using a computer that has no need to move
about.
--

Brian *-* Windows 10 Pro, 64-Bit, Version 20H2, Build 19042

Journalism 101: *If someone says it’s raining and another person says it’s
dry, it’s not your job to quote them both. It’s your job to look out the
f**king window and find out which is true.*

~ Jonathan Foster (attributed)





--
search for me on facebook, google+, orkut..
austinpinto.xaviers@...
follow me on twitter.
austinmpinto
contact me on skype.
austin.pinto3



 

Hi all,

I must say this is perhaps the best explanation of differences between wired and wireless networking I’ve read in quite a while (brings back memories from my college days studying all this). At the moment the latest standard is Wi-Fi 6 (IEEE 802.11ax), which may take months to years to become mainstream (currently 802.11ac is the mainstream).

Regarding 2.4 gigahertz band interference, technologies that can interfere with Wi-Fi include certain USB transceivers and Bluetooth (Bluetooth is a completely different concept than Wi-Fi).

Regarding security protocol, the latest mainstream protocol is WPA (Wi-Fi Protected Access) 2, with WPA3 released not long ago. Basically, security protocols rely on a complex mathematical formula deriving from a network’s password to make sure intruders cannot decrypt wireless traffic. The first security protocol was WEP (Wired-Equivalent Privacy) but was cracked (broken) shortly after. A few years later, WPA version 1 was introduced and cracked, too, with WPA2 and WPA3 being cracked shortly after their release. In the past, one method of decrypting wireless traffic was brute force password guessing – if you have a table of thousands of network names (SSID/Service Set Identifier) and most used passwords, you can uncover what computers are talking about. The bulk of network security (including Wi-Fi security protocol) is not really a focus of this forum, so I’ll leave it at that.

 

References:

 

For future reference: whenever you provide explanations, I advise putting links to helpful articles and overviews as references so people can look up more details if interested.

Cheers,

Joseph

 

From: win10@win10.groups.io <win10@win10.groups.io> On Behalf Of Sean Murphy
Sent: Saturday, January 9, 2021 9:24 PM
To: win10@win10.groups.io
Subject: Re: [win10] to wifi or not to wifi

 

All,

 

I need to outline some basic networking concepts to explain why physical connection via a copper CAT 5 or higher is faster than wireless. I will provide a caveat in relation when using USB. These are very high level concepts.

 

Ethernet is a shared protocol thus (ISO layer 2 data link) kicks in here. Layer 2 is the grouping of data between two physical devices. Such as an Wireless Access point and a wired switch / hub. I will touch on these a bit later.

 

Wireless is technically a shared layer 1 (ISO standards physical layer), in other words is the technology used to send the data to the receiving device. The Access point (Wireless router) in a domestic world can have to radios at 2.4 GHZ or 5GHZ. Some routers combine these two different frequencies as a special frequency hop capability  which basically means if the 5ghz SSID cannot be connected, the Access point (AP) will automatically switch you to the 2.4 ghz radio. The speeds of 802.11 ranges from 54 mbs through to 1300 ghz, there is a higher throughput capability for 802.11 which I have never seen in domestic wireless routers. Thus I will not talk about it. The norm when using 802.11 AC or AD is around 300 to 400 mbs. The challenges with wireless:

  • Any physical obstructions impacts the quality of the signal which impacts your speed.
  • The quality of your AP impacts the speed of your traffic.
  • Number of devices on the network. If you have a large number of devices, the through put will reduce.
  • The quality of the radio / chip set in your laptop. A dual radio within a laptop is better than one.
  • Distance impacts your speed. The greater distance you are away from the AP quality of your signal goes down and thus your performance. All the faster speed standards are greatly impacted in this area. Where 802.11 A had a huge distance over 100 metres from memory.
  • Latency heavily impacts wireless technology. Just perform a ping using your wireless device to your local AP and then do the same ping test using wire. Wire is 0, wireless is always higher. This does have an impact
  • Signal noise also impacts your wireless performance. This could be moisture in the air. 2.4 GHZ used to be heavily impacted with SN but not so much at 5GHZ as the devices which impacted wireless do not use that frequency.
  • Packet collision – when your packet is received at the same time by another packet from a different device. The packets are not handled by the AP and the packets are requested to be sent again. This is the problem with shared network technology. Wired Ethernet hubs  have the same issue and are no longer available.

There will be other issues here such as encryption, amount of traffic, etc that can also impact your wireless.

 

Physical connections:

If you are using a hub as stated before, your throughput will be impacted. Today all domestic routers / Wi-Fi devices are true switches thus you do not get this issue. Hence your throughput from your pc to the router via a copper cable is going to be at 1gbs if that is the specifications. In fact, when you copy a file from one pc to another on the same network using physical cables. Then the throughput is at what ever speed the two devices can handle which with todays new pcs should be close to 1gbs.

 

Note: A hub is a layer 1 device for ethernet wired devices. Similar to an Wi-Fi access point but really brain dead. A switch is technically a layer 2 device which supports single connection between the switch and the end device. The switch handles all the communication in a clever way to prevent packet collision as outline before. This is why you get better throughput on wired networks with switch and also routers. I will not explain routers here.

to

Standard cat 5 supports up to 100 metres / 60 ft without signal loss from memory. Over this distance, you will get signal loss. Thus in theory if your network port is 100 mbs or 1gbs, then this is the speed you should get. Now there is cat 6E which I don’t recall the specs but primarily for 1gbs throughput. Using copper unshielded twisted pair cables you don’t get single loss if you are within the specifications. Latency between any device that is connected on a wired network in your house will be 0. Only time it might creep up if you have huge amount of data going over your network. EG: copying your whole hard drive from one pc to another and then you want to watch a video from the other hard drive.

All the other issues I have outlined for wi-fi does not apply to wired networks.

 

Note: to understand your real throughput  in bytes is not a simple formula of dividing by 8. EG: 100 mbps / 8 is 12.5 MBps (Megabytes per second). As there are networking protocols to take into account here and the quality of your network equipment. This also applies to wireless. The best I have ever seen with 100 mBps is around 8 to 10 megabytes per second.

The only issues with wired networks:

  • Quality of cables.
  • Quality of the Network Interface Card (NIC). USB adapters fall in this space. If the USB Ethernet dongle is not high quality, then your performance will b impacted as outlined already on this thread. USB B should be able to handle 1gbs throughput, but I have not done any research in this space. As all the devices I buy have physical  NICS.
  • You are locked at your desk.

 

In conclusion:

If you are using the internet then it doesn’t really matter if you use wired or wireless. As your connection to the internet is going to be the biggest issue here and the sites you visit. The issue of performance is far to complex to explain here. Lets just say, there are so many variables and issues here that trying to truly understand your real performance is not a worthwhile activity for the average person. If you are getting performance issues using a conference tool like Teams, WebEx or Zoom (the only three I will use). Is the issue at your end, the service you using or something in-between. As someone who was a network engineer for Cisco in their Technical Assistance Centre. Trying to explain throughput and performance to customers was a real challenge. AS the average person doesn’t understand this concept at the technical level. Lets just say, there is a lot of hidden overheads when talking about networking equipment.

 

Sean

 

 

 

From: win10@win10.groups.io <win10@win10.groups.io> On Behalf Of Monte Single
Sent: Sunday, January 10, 2021 1:01 PM
To: win10@win10.groups.io
Subject: Re: [win10] to wifi or not to wifi

 

Thanks for all the answers.

For me a wired connection is best; I can see how a wifi  is best for others.

 

From: win10@win10.groups.io <win10@win10.groups.io> On Behalf Of Kevin Minor
Sent: January 9, 2021 7:00 PM
To: win10@win10.groups.io
Subject: Re: [win10] to wifi or not to Wi-Fi

 

Hi Monte.

 

The laptop I have doesn’t have an Ethernet connection, so I got one that uses USB for its connection. With it plugged in, I had more intermittent connection to the internet, and my speed seemed slower. Things seem more stable with WI-FI. I had it directly connected to the PC, no hub was involved. The only reason I’d have a hard wired connection is if a job requires it.

 

This is my experience. Others may differ.

 

Kevin, Valerie and Jilly

 

From: win10@win10.groups.io <win10@win10.groups.io> On Behalf Of Monte Single
Sent: Saturday, January 9, 2021 7:50 PM
To: win10@win10.groups.io
Subject: [win10] to wifi or not to wifi

 

Hi List,

 

I’ve seen   a couple messages on the list in the last 10 minutes,  and they seem to suggest that a wifi connection is more stable than an ethernet connection.

I would have thought the wired connection would be  better all round including things like zoom.

Would someone please clarify?

 

Cheers,

 

Monte


Brian Vogel <britechguy@...>
 

On Sun, Jan 10, 2021 at 12:24 AM, Sean Murphy wrote:
If you are using the internet then it doesn’t really matter if you use wired or wireless.
-
I'm sorry, but as an unqualified statement that's very simply incorrect.

There are many situations (one of which was already described, the presence of a multi-WiFi network rich operating environment) that has the potential to have significant impacts on WiFi performance on heavy traffic channels (and older hardware isn't trying to seek out empty channels).  Ethernet never has this issue.

The above being said, I absolutely agree that trying to describe throughput is somewhat an exercise in futility.  I always use the example of either a series of pipes and hoses delivering water, where the fastest flow you will get in the whole collection is determined by the narrowest constriction in that series, or of a bucket brigade where you have individuals who are significantly slower "somewhere in the middle, somewhere" and this is what limits the ultimate number of buckets you get, and at what speed, on the end where the water gets thrown.

I'm constantly trying to explain to my partner that the reason that Zoom, for instance, is slow and flaky is almost never going to be the result of something on his machine, which has way more than enough firepower to handle it all at once.  It's because, somewhere out there in cyberspace, there's a hitch in the gitty-up of the data coming to and going from his computer to the meeting hub and/or participants.  The same is true when the browsing experience in general slows down.  And there are times where the end you're trying to reach from wherever you are happens to be down entirely.  All of these things happen, both singly, and sometimes in combination.
 
--

Brian - Windows 10 Pro, 64-Bit, Version 20H2, Build 19042

Journalism 101:  If someone says it’s raining and another person says it’s dry, it’s not your job to quote them both. It’s your job to look out the f**king window and find out which is true.

      ~ Jonathan Foster (attributed)


Jerry Hogan
 

I disagree, WiFi wireless is going to up and down with the signal and using a Ethernet with a cat5 cable or better will give you a steady signal rather wirless signal, my wife streaming Romania box she get 45 channel and have the Ethernet cable she does not lose no signal and I do not have to put in a password for her box, she was losing picture with wirless, but now I have Google Fiber with 1GB up and down, I did a speed test on my Eero mess syster and I have 600 to 900 up and down  for the MB.

Jerry Hogan

 

From: win10@win10.groups.io <win10@win10.groups.io> On Behalf Of Brian Vogel
Sent: Sunday, January 10, 2021 11:26 AM
To: win10@win10.groups.io
Subject: Re: [win10] to wifi or not to wifi

 

On Sun, Jan 10, 2021 at 12:24 AM, Sean Murphy wrote:

If you are using the internet then it doesn’t really matter if you use wired or wireless.

-
I'm sorry, but as an unqualified statement that's very simply incorrect.

There are many situations (one of which was already described, the presence of a multi-WiFi network rich operating environment) that has the potential to have significant impacts on WiFi performance on heavy traffic channels (and older hardware isn't trying to seek out empty channels).  Ethernet never has this issue.

The above being said, I absolutely agree that trying to describe throughput is somewhat an exercise in futility.  I always use the example of either a series of pipes and hoses delivering water, where the fastest flow you will get in the whole collection is determined by the narrowest constriction in that series, or of a bucket brigade where you have individuals who are significantly slower "somewhere in the middle, somewhere" and this is what limits the ultimate number of buckets you get, and at what speed, on the end where the water gets thrown.

I'm constantly trying to explain to my partner that the reason that Zoom, for instance, is slow and flaky is almost never going to be the result of something on his machine, which has way more than enough firepower to handle it all at once.  It's because, somewhere out there in cyberspace, there's a hitch in the gitty-up of the data coming to and going from his computer to the meeting hub and/or participants.  The same is true when the browsing experience in general slows down.  And there are times where the end you're trying to reach from wherever you are happens to be down entirely.  All of these things happen, both singly, and sometimes in combination.
 
--

Brian - Windows 10 Pro, 64-Bit, Version 20H2, Build 19042

Journalism 101:  If someone says it’s raining and another person says it’s dry, it’s not your job to quote them both. It’s your job to look out the f**king window and find out which is true.

      ~ Jonathan Foster (attributed)


enes sarıbaş
 

Hi Brian,

I have to add another  situation people should be aware of. If you use a USB 3 device, the USB emitts an RF frequency that will disrupt and forcefully disconnect 2.4 ghz wi fi. I had this problem, and this simply isn't a thing with ethernet. Therefore, if you do transfers or use a  USB 3 device, you won't have network conectivity if you utilize such a networ,



On 1/10/2021 11:26 AM, Brian Vogel wrote:
On Sun, Jan 10, 2021 at 12:24 AM, Sean Murphy wrote:
If you are using the internet then it doesn’t really matter if you use wired or wireless.
-
I'm sorry, but as an unqualified statement that's very simply incorrect.

There are many situations (one of which was already described, the presence of a multi-WiFi network rich operating environment) that has the potential to have significant impacts on WiFi performance on heavy traffic channels (and older hardware isn't trying to seek out empty channels).  Ethernet never has this issue.

The above being said, I absolutely agree that trying to describe throughput is somewhat an exercise in futility.  I always use the example of either a series of pipes and hoses delivering water, where the fastest flow you will get in the whole collection is determined by the narrowest constriction in that series, or of a bucket brigade where you have individuals who are significantly slower "somewhere in the middle, somewhere" and this is what limits the ultimate number of buckets you get, and at what speed, on the end where the water gets thrown.

I'm constantly trying to explain to my partner that the reason that Zoom, for instance, is slow and flaky is almost never going to be the result of something on his machine, which has way more than enough firepower to handle it all at once.  It's because, somewhere out there in cyberspace, there's a hitch in the gitty-up of the data coming to and going from his computer to the meeting hub and/or participants.  The same is true when the browsing experience in general slows down.  And there are times where the end you're trying to reach from wherever you are happens to be down entirely.  All of these things happen, both singly, and sometimes in combination.
 
--

Brian - Windows 10 Pro, 64-Bit, Version 20H2, Build 19042

Journalism 101:  If someone says it’s raining and another person says it’s dry, it’s not your job to quote them both. It’s your job to look out the f**king window and find out which is true.

      ~ Jonathan Foster (attributed)


Brian Vogel <britechguy@...>
 

On Sun, Jan 10, 2021 at 12:44 PM, Jerry Hogan wrote:
I disagree
-
I have no idea with what, as what you've said is just echoes precisely the objection I raised.  There are plenty of times where ethernet connections will be faster and more stable than a WiFi connection even could be.

For those who are in a "non-mobile" situation where whatever device they're using doesn't move, and the option to use ethernet exists, it's worth using it rather than WiFi, even if WiFi is an option.  There are times where even a stationary machine is in a part of the house/building where running cable is just not going to happen, and when that's the case WiFi is a godsend.
--

Brian - Windows 10 Pro, 64-Bit, Version 20H2, Build 19042

Journalism 101:  If someone says it’s raining and another person says it’s dry, it’s not your job to quote them both. It’s your job to look out the f**king window and find out which is true.

      ~ Jonathan Foster (attributed)


Hamit Campos
 

Wow Google Fiber? I wana hear more about that. Email me off list please Jarry. I wana see about getting it. Thanks. hamitcampos@...

 

From: win10@win10.groups.io <win10@win10.groups.io> On Behalf Of Jerry Hogan
Sent: Sunday, January 10, 2021 12:45 PM
To: win10@win10.groups.io
Subject: Re: [win10] to wifi or not to wifi

 

I disagree, WiFi wireless is going to up and down with the signal and using a Ethernet with a cat5 cable or better will give you a steady signal rather wirless signal, my wife streaming Romania box she get 45 channel and have the Ethernet cable she does not lose no signal and I do not have to put in a password for her box, she was losing picture with wirless, but now I have Google Fiber with 1GB up and down, I did a speed test on my Eero mess syster and I have 600 to 900 up and down  for the MB.

Jerry Hogan

 

From: win10@win10.groups.io <win10@win10.groups.io> On Behalf Of Brian Vogel
Sent: Sunday, January 10, 2021 11:26 AM
To: win10@win10.groups.io
Subject: Re: [win10] to wifi or not to wifi

 

On Sun, Jan 10, 2021 at 12:24 AM, Sean Murphy wrote:

If you are using the internet then it doesn’t really matter if you use wired or wireless.

-
I'm sorry, but as an unqualified statement that's very simply incorrect.

There are many situations (one of which was already described, the presence of a multi-WiFi network rich operating environment) that has the potential to have significant impacts on WiFi performance on heavy traffic channels (and older hardware isn't trying to seek out empty channels).  Ethernet never has this issue.

The above being said, I absolutely agree that trying to describe throughput is somewhat an exercise in futility.  I always use the example of either a series of pipes and hoses delivering water, where the fastest flow you will get in the whole collection is determined by the narrowest constriction in that series, or of a bucket brigade where you have individuals who are significantly slower "somewhere in the middle, somewhere" and this is what limits the ultimate number of buckets you get, and at what speed, on the end where the water gets thrown.

I'm constantly trying to explain to my partner that the reason that Zoom, for instance, is slow and flaky is almost never going to be the result of something on his machine, which has way more than enough firepower to handle it all at once.  It's because, somewhere out there in cyberspace, there's a hitch in the gitty-up of the data coming to and going from his computer to the meeting hub and/or participants.  The same is true when the browsing experience in general slows down.  And there are times where the end you're trying to reach from wherever you are happens to be down entirely.  All of these things happen, both singly, and sometimes in combination.
 
--

Brian - Windows 10 Pro, 64-Bit, Version 20H2, Build 19042

Journalism 101:  If someone says it’s raining and another person says it’s dry, it’s not your job to quote them both. It’s your job to look out the f**king window and find out which is true.

      ~ Jonathan Foster (attributed)